posted on April 9, 2006 at 11:11 pm

good monday morning to you
today im goin in to edit the footage
of the cchhru at the basement
ive already seen it
and its gonna be a real silk purse from a sows ear job
believe me
not cos i look like ive thoroughly lived
every one of them 51 years (baybee)
tho i do
not cos of bad sound and mistakes
tho it has these
but for the indefinable magic
that has been lost
the thing that held it all aloft
the glue that held it all in place
you know when people say
you hadda be there
theres some sense in that
i can think of so very very few live performances
that have not withered reproduced
in the sunny confines of yer living room
able to control the volume
ff and rewind
light n dark
the band have lost the hegemony
the audiences clappin n screamin
have receded to a polite smatter
the expressions of exstacy
pain abandonment
the grimacing that a guitar seems to wanna
make ya do
those crowsfoot inducing loud roars
instead of singing it proply
the impossible closeups
that no one would ever see
no one has ever really filmed us live
and captured it
cos it aint possible
the closest thing
believe it or not
is a single shot
of the whole band
from halfway up the middle
of the audience
thats who the bands playin’ to
not to a camera
six inches above and away from
yer left temple
so ya gotta see the whole band at once
its nonsensical to focus on the singer
thats why theyre a band, right?
i dunno
ive never felt the magic in live recordings neither
you gotta be there
thats it really
if you aint there
you cant get the feeling
on a cd or dvd at home
youve isolated one alkaloid
out of a whole drug
dont be surprised if the results
are disappointing
now ive realised this my whole life
im trying to think now
of a record that i like thats live
get your ya yas out
is the only one i can think of
and that cos it possibly snuck in
before mah critical faculties
sharpened up to todays
fever pitch
(nothin’ can get over the bar)
but as for anythin else
theyre all disappointin
(yeah dylan bootlegs too)
(and the dead, i cant understand
the dead AT ALL)
and all those tedious bowies double
live bore a thons
its like filming a play
it doesnt work
its wooden
its pedestrian
the cchhru live is a conceit
that needs an audience
it plays to the audience
it cannot play to a camera
the cchhru n cameras
do not intersect
its a one off thing
for that night
on dvd
on cd
the jokes dont make ya laugh
the music dont make ya love
the performance dont make ya live
so whats , uh, the deal…?
i dunno
its filmed now
i must only hope for amelioration
i must placate the inexorable gods
expressed in pixels n blanks
shadow n light
persistence of vision
you see muddy
i’ll steal from anywhere



41 Responses to “the underhold :how it affects you”

  1. avatar
    CeciliaGin | 9 April 2006 at 11:45 pm #

    Hola mi amor.
    Todavia no leo tu bloggie, pero queria mandarte un fuerte abrazo!

  2. avatar
    Anonymous | 9 April 2006 at 11:52 pm #

    live stuff is never quite alive is it…paradox…

  3. avatar
    CeciliaGin | 9 April 2006 at 11:53 pm #

    A live record…
    a taped performance…
    Both aid my anticipation as they are hints of what awaits me…and a reminder for when it’s all over.

    La voz no la vendemos…
    Our voice is not for sale


  4. avatar
    RA | 10 April 2006 at 12:11 am #

    Hmm I see what you say, but maybe your perspective, as a performer is not valid, when talking to us watchers/listeners.

    There’s a few live albums/DVD’s I love, but maybe as I’ve nver performed, i don’t look at them like you do..

    Put yourself in my ears/eyse and look at…

    Live at Leeds – John Martyn

    Rush – In Rio

    The The – Versus the World

    These are great performances, captured beautifully. Maybe not in the artists eyes, but as a fan, they are superb.

    Remember that when you produce a live album/DVD for us fans. You may be underwhelmed, but we’ll enjoy it. Our memories of great live Church performances (The Garage, London 98, for instance) will always surpass the recording, but having a properly produced snapshot of our faveourite band live will be a graet artifact.

    By the way, it ain’t monday mornng as I respond.. it’s late sunday night in frosty-real-ale-tinged- Soutport.

    Peace, love and good happiness stuff to you and all.


    (ps positive vibrations for E’s op too)

  5. avatar
    captainmission | 10 April 2006 at 12:16 am #

    as much as i desire the church live dvds and cds, i really take your point, tis true. my memories seeing you over the years are filled with amazing emotive feelings, we can’t ever recapture those but they imprinted upon my conciousness like magickal events.

    dvd idea- church play to the rainforest, no people, just the wildlife and trees, half in daylight, half at night, bit like pink floyd at pompei, kinda abstract, no talking, just the music.

  6. avatar
    Brad | 10 April 2006 at 12:37 am #

    Jazz seems to work well live. In fact studio recorded jazz often seems wrong. Bill Evans Trio – A Night at the Village Vanguard is this point at it’s best.

    It’s fun though how seeing a band live and hearing recordings of songs come alive is always (almost) so much better than the recording, obviously. And it’s that full 6 senses experience that makes it so. An audio/video reproduction will fail to some extent.

    When I met Peter in Atlanta he was asked by someone else about a church live album, he said that was “bad business,” and left it at that. That might be his way of saying the same as what you are here, in a PK way.


  7. avatar
    fergal | 10 April 2006 at 1:02 am #

    what’s, uh, the deal?
    got to make it to the next meal ….

  8. avatar
    Anonymous | 10 April 2006 at 1:37 am #

    Just listened to Jazz. Man, the shit you don’t put on the albums is 10,000 times (10,000 miles?) better than any other shit out there. I hope you guys make 10 more albums!

    As for the live stuff, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. True Church fans will love any live stuff you put out there. Seriously. So it isn’t captured 100% as if you were there – just remember – A 50% representation of The Church is better than anything else anybody else is doing. Seriously.

    Love and best wishes to Elektra this week.

  9. avatar
    the dean | 10 April 2006 at 1:42 am #

    sk you are your own worst critic. the church were great that night.
    the audience live and at home experience something totally different. As I was at a the basement, I’m looking forward to seeing the show again. It will be interesting to test your view.

  10. avatar
    Daberhasher | 10 April 2006 at 1:46 am #

    alright, alright… as an admitted deadhead with many shows under my patchouli scented hat, i will totally declare there is no greater sonic travesty than a live dead recording out of context…
    you had to be there, plain and simple… on acid… lots of acid… that part is hard to recreate too….i always thought the endless live tape collecting was totally synonomous with baseball cards or something… ahh, but we’ll recreate to whatever silk purse you glean from the megabytes of digital imagery, skeditor… didja give the camera a good rock-n-roll tongue waggle, you know, gene genie simmonsy and all??? oh well, i agree with brad there about the live jazz thing… it’s the improvisation i reckon, letting the night dress the framework… the good live rock album is a rare beast indeed, may i offer…
    neil young-live rust

    bob marley and the wailers
    -babylon by bus

    primus-suck on this

    derek and the dominoes-in concert

    i’ll admit, i never much cared whether or not there would ever be a live church album or dvd… i do hope for at least one more night under los chchru’s spell however…
    that said, for all the fans in far flung lands, whose shores you’ll never grace, this may be, though flawed to you , their lone glimpse of the empty place…
    good luck widit there…
    sorry for blogging on your blog…

    positivity for e and all you kilbees over this time…


  11. avatar
    CAPTAIN BEYOND | 10 April 2006 at 2:09 am #

    Me am sorry bout having cameras in your eyes but it is the only way to spread the word of The Church. Me know you can’t play for every human being on this planet live, but every human being on this planet should hear your words and music of at least once. It will mean more to your fans than to you and me. You know what me mean. You can’t leave this life time until you have made me movie you see. (haha)…

  12. avatar
    Anonymous | 10 April 2006 at 2:13 am #

    You’re right, esskay.

    Ya can’t replicate the live experience on a screen.
    Nor through any round piece of plastic.

    But you can have excellent filmic art.
    The kind that synergises with the experience or “story” that it’s documenting.

    There are film artists out there whose intent is purely to do this with other artists – whether they be in music, the visual or even literary arts.

    Perhaps The Chucrh just hasn’t found the right collaborators yet to create such a thing.

    But don’t stop looking.


  13. avatar
    Tony Pucci | 10 April 2006 at 2:16 am #

    People say
    You just had to be there
    And all the time
    You know they’ve never been there

  14. avatar
    Anonymous | 10 April 2006 at 2:25 am #

    peter gabriel plays live

  15. avatar
    Anonymous | 10 April 2006 at 2:30 am #

    It’s all subjective isn’t it. I personally would love to see a church gig with close-ups. As I love your petty faces. As ra pointed out I think most church fans would know the differnce and understand that a DVD is more of a snapshot and could not compensate for the true magic of the show, depite this I love most of my DVD’s,some work some don’t but I still like them.
    Take the NIN DVD(and all that could have been) for example, it was ficking brilliant(simply filmed with 6 handheld camcorders and did the editing on mac pro) , yet I was really disappointed with their last Melbourne gig, expecting it to be as good as the DVD. The sound was good but it was not as good and did not have the energy the DVD had.
    Then there is the reverse with Bowie, the Melbourne gig was great but Reality tour DVD sound was tripe although I could understand the vibe and the emotion, I still love and enjoyed it.
    I don’t know its seems like alot of pressure to film only one show and expect that that one night represents every other show.
    If you had the luxury of filming over the course of a tour or maybe 3-4 shows then went into the editing room, might take off the preasure.
    As a fan I would love to see a live DVD with a roc doc/behind the scenes/interviews etc. I’m sure every church fan would.
    Mayby uni film students or SAE students would do it for free, those institutions have alot of cutting edge equipment and resourse and are usually looking for projects for there top students.
    I reckon the olde captain M got a great idea too.

  16. avatar
    Anonymous | 10 April 2006 at 2:42 am #

    Not a fan of the live thing either…For a brief minute, I was a cure fan and while the sound sucks, I always thought Concert was pretty good. At least I have good memories of it. Certainly not as produced as later live discs but way more of an experience for the listener. The black and white cassette and the smell of djarms mixed with a lil weed. Cute wannabe darksider girls with all their black eyeliner…Some only speaking German…anyone?

    I also remember a Church boot record at Maxwells that sounded like shit but leaves me with pretty good memories since I found it used on a road trip to CA and it was the first time I had heard the earlier stuff live.

    Yeah, the live thing is never as good as being at the show, but being there can mean different things to different listeners. Just think sk, someone will get turned on to the church after listening to your live stuff being reproduced and for that one person, it will always be remembered as being great.

    Oh yeah, I bought a copy of the Pixies show after seeing the concert on their reunion tour. I think it’s better than the studio stuff.


  17. avatar
    Anonymous | 10 April 2006 at 2:49 am #

    A great live DVD whose format would suit The Chchru is Death Cab For Cutie’s “Drive Well, Sleep Carefully”. Live bits, interviews, not too serious…

  18. avatar
    matt davison | 10 April 2006 at 2:53 am #

    It would be remiss of me SK not to voice my opinion. SK u can get the live , awsome feeling thing..U just need the right creatve director to do it.. The music has to meet the mind and the visuals need to paint the picture of the you are the moment x factor thing.
    look at U2 in the elevation tour.. Steadicam floating around the room… etc etc….all I can say is why??Why can you not create that like you do with your music.

  19. avatar
    MattDavison | 10 April 2006 at 2:56 am #

    ps… It has to be someone who
    I mean REALLY understands them.

  20. avatar
    persephone2u | 10 April 2006 at 3:49 am #

    The Dead. Did they even have a reason for existing?

    Live is never as good as being there, but without a live Doors album we would never have been treated to this priceless Jim Morrison test of his fans :

    Morrison: I am a sagittarius. The MOST philosophical of all the signs.

    Sycophantic female fan screaming: Me too, Jim! I’m a sagittarius too!

    Morrison: But anyway, I don’t believe in that stuff. I think it’s a bunch of bullshit is what I think it is.

    Same Sycophantic female fan: I don’t believe in it either, Jim!

  21. avatar
    CAPTAIN BEYOND | 10 April 2006 at 3:49 am #

    hmmm…me am that someone bay bee…

  22. avatar
    Rehan | 10 April 2006 at 3:56 am #

    Wot’s uh the deal…? Well, the gold it’s in the…”Live at Leeds” by The Who also Dylan’s Manchester Free Trade Hall concert bootleg with the Hawks…but hey… Captain Mission’s idea is great
    Love to you and Elektra.

  23. avatar
    Ross | 10 April 2006 at 4:14 am #

    I’ll buy it.


  24. avatar
    Thomas Irvin | 10 April 2006 at 4:28 am #

    It is certainly difficult to capture that intangible thing that happens live, and that most everyone here has felt at a Church show. But I have seen it done, at least once: Shake: Otis at Monterey was filmed by D.A. Pennebaker and is jaw-droppingly good. I had no prior experience with Otis Redding, other than “Sitting On The Dock Of The Bay” which I never much cared for. But live, he was an entirely different creature. And this film actually captured that elusive thing.

  25. avatar
    Azza | 10 April 2006 at 4:31 am #

    I’m with ross, I’d buy it aswell.
    So why the Sydney gig? I saw at least two cameras taping in Melbourne. That was a great gig you should use that.

    Best wishes tomorrow……

  26. avatar
    eek | 10 April 2006 at 5:12 am #

    I agree with you. A recording, whether video or audio, dosen’t ever adequately capture a live show. It just doesn’t.

    However…I’d buy it. And I’d enjoy it for what it is, not despise it for what it isn’t. Since chances are good I won’t be moving to Sydney or Melbourne (or anywhere in Australia), a live dvd is my best stop-gap measure between my very occasional live Church fixes. And as that, it will work. Maybe I give too much credit to people, but I don’t think most really expect a recording to fully capture the experience and power of live music.

    Or you could scrap the whole thing and whenever I get the urge to see The Church live you guys could hop a plane and come play in my living room!

    hmmm… Yeah, I think I really like that idea. Let’s do that. 🙂

    My best wishes to Elektra, you, and your family for a successful, complication-free surgery. I’ll be thinking of you all.

  27. avatar
    Anonymous | 10 April 2006 at 6:28 am #

    The comment above about the Doors
    is basically what I was thinking.
    That’s weird, I was watching that
    Oliver Stone movie last night.

    I think everyone gets that concert
    films don’t capture the essence of
    being there.
    But…they freeze time for someone
    in the future who might want to see
    what a Church concert was like.

    I like watching concert footage of
    Bands from the 60’s 70’s that I
    never got to see.

    I’ll never get to see Jimi Hendrix
    live, so film gives a vague idea of
    what it was like.

    Best Wishes to you and your family


  28. avatar
    si-kli | 10 April 2006 at 7:29 am #

    church could do a gig in those bondi caves that midnight oil did power & passion clip in.
    Moody AND close to home.
    Film clip idea (blahba). nite-time neon streets after rain reflecting blurred colours, lenses follow paths of various member’s travels thru said terrain, finding each other eventually (after various strangeness) together at their gig. That whole what you have to go through to get on stage thingo. Blend-ending in coastal forest (ie. around Broken Head)to awakening dawnrays, and while normally you oldies would/should have nodded off to bed hours earlier, be hangin round a nice spot down the beach.If your’e feeling fit enough enough you could show off your swimming athleticism body surfin’. There’s a test of courage, bit Oz crawl circa. Errol ha!
    It’s all in the lifestyle etc. Living the life.
    Gotta give some of these young rocka’s something to aim at man.
    Show the world; they’ll envy ya.
    Don’t just display yourselves as nocturnal ghosts.
    Did you have candles, a couple of lamps, some nice persian rugs, inscence sticks at Basement?
    I remember the Marylin Monroe red velvet curtains opening at Sidknee’s Tivoli revealing billowing plumes of inscence smoke and you guys striking up a magical build up to a rawkous rockin racket.
    Sitesoundsmelltouch(couldfeelda bass) spectacular filling of the senses. hmmm..
    Now where was i?
    Live is hard due to volume at gigs suiting LOUD volumes not TV speakers, and unless you are really jumping around, can look incredibly static. You guys let your music do the talking, and anyone into the band knows that.

  29. avatar
    Anonymous | 10 April 2006 at 10:59 am #

    I think you judge too harshly, SK. You look younger with each passing day, especially up close… I found ‘Postcard from Down Under’ to be very good. But for the 2 second break between tracks, I could be back there, watching you watching yourself on the big screen…

  30. avatar
    Anonymous | 10 April 2006 at 11:58 am #

    yep yep I remember saying to a mate that you looked both younger and older at the same time after u started sporting the beard and shed the pounds…a living conundrum…

  31. avatar
    Krissythegroupie | 10 April 2006 at 1:34 pm #

    Botox! *joking* Bah! to all those people that obsess over looking older! Like Dorothy Parker said,

    “….If I’m in bed each night by ten,
    I may get back my looks again,
    If I abstain from fun and such,
    I’ll probably amount to much,
    But I shall stay the way I am,
    Because I do not give a damn.”

  32. avatar
    sue cee | 10 April 2006 at 1:48 pm #

    Capturing the essence of a live gig is a hard one, know exactly what you mean tho’ I had to look up ‘hegemony’ 🙂

    Im sure with the experience behind the cameras there’s some abstract stuff there and maybe you’re looking too hard? The ABC’s Studio 22 filming was pretty golden to me.

    My best to e for tomorrow

  33. avatar
    CSTCoach | 10 April 2006 at 2:55 pm #


    As I wait impatiently for my pre-order of ULTC to ship, i couldn’t resist listening to the sound samples online. It was a moment of weakness. Now I’m suffering unbelievable torment. Waiting is even worse once you’ve been teased like this.

    Perhaps it sounds corny (though I get the feeling that the people on here are the only ones it wouldn’t sound corny to), but Unified Field made me break out in goosebumps, caused my stomach to butterfly soar, and brought a beautiful mist to my eyes. I’m not kidding. And that was just 30 seconds. Then I heard the full song on MySpace.

    I don’t know what to say. Beautiful. Fucking beautiful, man. The music soars, there’s so many layers, so much going on, and the lyrics and your vocals are sublime. Really fine work. It’s magic.

    love to e. and to all of you, take care, get well.


  34. avatar
    Anonymous | 10 April 2006 at 3:20 pm #

    The reservations are understandble,
    but as a band yu guys are very photogenic
    and sound great live,
    honestly I appreciate the enmore dvd
    but I know you guys can offer a much better fare for the legacy
    I luckily have a live in Italy show that blows it all away
    and while I was never there, I believe there is an imprint
    that is left on the mind at every performance
    if yu fine tune the sound it hardly comes of as a puppet show


    the Dead: Europe 72 is remarkable, china cat sunflower
    dont leave the planet without the grace..


  35. avatar
    trickster | 10 April 2006 at 4:16 pm #

    i agree… somewhat, skil-bro

    pf in pompeii- with a whole audience of ghosts- not bad, not bad.

    you were just at the wrong venue w/ the wrong audience & the Eyes- the wrong time-space, perhaps?

    if ya don like it, don let it happen!

    peace and visnu!

  36. avatar
    Anonymous | 10 April 2006 at 8:42 pm #

    Steve – I’m a dim receiver…I just got “Block” and I’m lovin it! No band knows how to build the tension quite like The Church. Fuckin’ awesome.

    Marc in Philly

  37. avatar
    f in dead phoenix | 11 April 2006 at 12:05 am #

    I know these things are difficult to make.
    They are also difficult to get and to “get”.
    Dont look a gift Church in the
    Good luck tomorrow.

  38. avatar
    Daniel Watkins "Centuryhouse" | 11 April 2006 at 3:04 am #

    Nothing is ever going to capture the exact mood of the show in it’s splendor and awe. It’s like a photo of a person will never capture the fullness of being of a person and their life.

    But that photo is better than no record at all, and it’s a great reminder for those that have had the experience – a great way to bring them back to it.

    I’ve still got live audience recordings I made at three of the Church shows I saw, and they being me back every time.

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